CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
cekramer
Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 20 cave junction, or |
2004-10-12 98176
I just got a JD 4310 HST with 420 Loader and 48 backhoe with the advise of the dealer, CaCl filled rear tires. Two questions seeking advise:
1) If one tire has considerably more CaCl fill than the other can this lead to more instability (roll over wise) in one direction than the other? Should I balance the fill?
2) Are there any numbers for the angle over which this configuration is prone to roll?
Chuck
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon Pics |
2004-10-12 98179
Anything that changes the weight distribution of the tractor will change the center of gravity, including the weight and height of the driver, bucket size and content and position, rear ballast, tire size, fluid levels, and even inflation pressure. Once the CG falls outside the tractors footprint it is likely to roll. Manufacturers can't account for all of this so cannot give a number. Even if they did things can change in a hurry so you shouldn't operate at the limit. If one tire drops in a depression or climbs a hidden rock the CG will change mighty quick.
If you suspect your tires aren't filled evenly call the dealer. A proper fill is about 75% so the fluid completely covers the rim yet leaves enough air to allow for carcass flexibility and shock absorbtion. ....
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada Pics |
2004-10-12 98180
Your instincts are correct, both tires should be filled evenly.
There are no angle numbers published. That is a factor that changes constantly with ground conditions, FEL position, etc.
If you are going to get into trouble, it will most likely be while everything is perfectly safe and suddenly you drop into an unseen hole on the down side of run over a rock on the high side.
Walk and inspect any side slopes you intend to work, use your God given common sense and you will be ok. ....
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 4297 Southwest MiddleTennessee Pics |
2004-10-12 98191
If the SOPTM says it is too much.........it probably is. Best gauge of slope limits I've found so far.
SOPTM = Seat of Pants Tilt Meter ....
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
lbrown59
Join Date: Posts: 1 |
2004-10-12 98207
What would be considered
Steep slope
medium slope
mild or slight slope?
Also how do you determine what the angle of or degree of a slope is? ....
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada Pics |
2004-10-12 98215
The Chief & Herr Rankin (;-p) have it straight.
Use common sense and the 'pucker factor' to guide you, that and a little experience and you will be fine.
In the begining, practice, or try to drill into your noodle, if the machine gets unstable on a slope you want to do two things above all else, 1) drop FEL and 3pth ASAP, or faster, and b) turn INTO the downhill direction. Avoid if at all possible locking the brakes, skidding wheels give you less in the way of stopping power and no directional stability.
There is no hard & fast rule as to what is a steep slope. It will vary with factors as minute as sunny weather or not.
Best of luck. ....
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada Pics |
2004-10-13 98250
With all the house cleaning I have been doing lately I feel more like Frau Rankin.
If a slope is too steep to push a power mower across because it keeps curving downward or you can't comfortably push the mower up the hill, it is too steep for a tractor.
You can traverse such slopes in the right conditions, but only straight up and straight down and only in 4wd. ....
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
cekramer
Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 20 cave junction, or |
2004-10-13 98260
I see there have been alot of "experiences" with and with near roll over situations. All the words of caution have registered. The dealer "promises" to correct the over/under fill situation. So this web site has proven its value again. Thanks for the answers.
Chuck ....
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
cekramer
Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 20 cave junction, or |
2004-10-14 98351
The dealer sent a tire company to correct the over/under fill on the tires. His process was to raise the tractor, bleed all the excess fluid with the stem vertical until the fluid level was at the stem and raise the tire pressure to ~28psi. There was considerable fluid to bleed out from both tires. So I'd estimate 2-3 gals from one and 1-2 from the other.
My sense is that the dealer filled the tires with the TLB on the ground, the tires bulged and when he filled them to the stem level or above as the pressure increased the tires lost the buldge and thus we ended up with a nearly full fluid filled tire(s).
Anyone have any idea what the proper fill procedure should be?
Chuck ....
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon Pics |
2004-10-14 98352
This link describes proper hydroinflation procedure. ....
Link: Firestone Hydroinflation
 
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York Pics |
2004-10-14 98419
Most commercial machines can probably pump a tire to about 30 lbs on water fill which would be about three or so inches over the valve stem height when vertical. It does happen but the biggest conern is a level full foot print on the ground which means removal of air and unfortunately fluid to have the optimum benifit. ....
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
cekramer
Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 20 cave junction, or |
2004-10-30 99520
Since the tires were CaCl filled I have noticed both a rust color to the water as I check the tire pressures and rush around the vlave stems. Is this anything to be concerned about?
Chuck ....
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CaCl filled tires and roll over tendency
Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 4297 Southwest MiddleTennessee Pics |
2004-10-30 99522
This is pretty much what you can expect from an NaCl filled tire with it appears no tube installed to isolate the NaCl from the steel rim. The rust and corrosion will continue but most likely will take years to get to a point that will force you to make a repair. To repair this, you will have to remove the tire from the rim, sandblast or other method of removing rust and corrosion, prime & repaint rims and reinstall tire with an puncture resistant inner tube and then refill the tire. I would suggest Rim Guard to refill the tire but Rim Guard has less weight per gallon than NaCl. Your call on that. The Rim Guard is non-corrosive. (compose more or less of windshield wiper fluid) ....
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